Villainous Company

Uh ...let's see...the 70's...
Which 70's? The early ones with bell bottoms, Frye boots, flannel shirts, denim jackket and bandanas? The early mid-seventies with bell bottoms, earth shoes flannel shirts, military jackets and bandanas? Or the mid-to-late seventies with bell bottoms, boon dockers, chambray shirts and pea coats (not to mention my full dress uniform). It seems that I wore the same damned clothes the whole decade.

My high school yearbook photo was taken by my father in the back yard. I was wearing his suit coat, shirt nad tie. Out of the photo are my frayed bell bottoms and bare feet. Getting dressed up was not the order of my day.

Well I had to change somewhat when my parents put me in private school my Junior year.

We weren't allowed to wear blue jeans to school. As a matter of fact, the pants I was wearing in the picture weren't allowed because they had double-sewn seams.

So I went from wearing bell bottoms and flannels and cute little sweaters and t-shirts in tenth grade to khaki pants and buff-colored Levi's cords (illegal, but for some reason I generally got away with them) and docksiders (we weren't allowed to wear boots either) in 11th grade. I used to get demerits all the time for taking my shoes off though :)

And my yearbook picture (ugh!) was taken in one of those cheesy burgundy velvet drapes that were so big in the 70's, and we all had a little line of poetry or a quotation under our picture. Too funny.

My mom was reeeeeeeally into embroidery, so I had about 10 denim shirts with stuff embroidered all over them. Suns, flowers, little twee animals, etc. I also had a lime green gaucho outfit (complete with vest!) that I wore a Quiana shirt with, along with those lace-up knee-high boots. I was rockin' the 7th grade, let me tell you.

The summer of '76 or '77, Mom and her friend Jean discovered macrame' (along the Atkins diet and Tab) and we had macrame' crap all over our house. They would sit out by Jean's pool, slather on the Ban de Soliel, drink Tab, eat pork rinds, and macrame' their Rod McCuen-loving hearts out.

Ah, the 70s. Good times.

I remember platform shoes, yes I`ve worn them and almost broken an ankle.

One fad we had in school that I didn`t notice elsewhere was taking Wranglerâ„¢ Jeans and cutting the outside of the double stitched seam, on the outside of the leg, then pulling all the blue threads (which were vertical) out and leaving the white theads as a sort of frill.
It looked pretty cool and everybody at my school did it.
It didn`t work with Levis because the don`t have a double stitch on the outside, only on the inside, which if you tried it that way looked stupid.

Oh Lord... remember Orange? I had one of those funky shiny orange one-piece bathing suits with the sides cut out and the sort of criss-cross halter neck with the cutout in the middle. I thought I was so cool. I saw one in my bathing suit catalog the other day.

Yeah, my grandma gave me a chambray shirt with embroidery on it and I just kept a-goin'. It got way out of control. I had painted my bedroom florescent lime green and put up those glossy black adjustable shelves on the walls - it went with this Peter Max magic mushroom poster my cool cousin Andy, who was in the Navy had given me for my 15th birthday. When you turned on the black light (ooohh....) the whole room glowed.

What the heck were we thinking?

I think the worst outfit I ever had was this powder blue one: light blue palazzo (flared) pants with a blue paisley blouse and the baby blue crocheted lace vest that tied at the waist with that cutesy little cord string belt that threaded in and out of the lace. And the shoes! Cream colored leather baby dolls with big rounded toes and platforms and big chunky heels and little cutout designs on top.

Was I gorgeous or what?

Another hot outfit was a dark lime green, almost kelly green (like yours): tight little high-waisted pants, green shirt with tiny white polka-dots and white collar and cuffs, cropped jacket (think jean jacket, except it was the same fabric as the pants) in lime green. Actually I loved that outfit. Hah!

I owned several pairs of bell bottoms with cuffs in my sophomore year in high school (1973). Out of fashion the next year but I had to wear them again.

Dear God. The seventies have to be the worst decade in human history. Hippie attire went haywire, then Saturday Night fever gear, polyester suits, big collars, stupid fat ties. Remember cb radios? Convoy talk? Whats your handle? I also blame the seventies for Urban Cowboy, sure it came out in 80, but it was made in the seventies.

John Travolta should have been put out of our misery.

Now combine bell bottoms with cuffs with platform shoes and you have a recipe for a broken leg :)

And Pile, the 80's weren't much better.

Bad hair and worse music.

I'll be nice. I won't tell you my 70's story.

Oh c'mon. I just revealed myself as an incredible dorkwad in front of thousands of people (well, come to think of it, I do that every time I open my mouth - this was just more obvious because there were pictures).

It can't be much worse, Menace.

It's not worse for me. ]:-)

You sure?

Well, like on the Left Coast we were so much more hip than y'all. We wore buffalo sandals and camel hair coats because like, you never knew about the weather, you know?

Sailor pants, bush jeans, Dittos (yes, I wore phrench cut jeans at one time)and the blouses with the serged edge showing...the Prairie Look. Euw.
Not to mention Gunne Sax dresses...and Leisure suits! Euw euw euw euw...so oogie. Goucho pants.
waffle stompers, wallabees and Bear Trap shoes.

What do you mean the 80's were bad for hair????

I still have the same hair cut!! Heh.

My brother, who has curly red hair had a giant, and I mean enormous afro in the seventies. Gawd.

My other brother who was a pretty good photographer took a pic of him, just a head shot where it is dark, and there is a beam of light across his face, his eyes look stoned and there is smoke curling up in front of his face. Don't know what kind of smoke, he smoked lots of things. Very cool pic, very bad fashion.

Cricket, I was big on those peasant skirts with the petticoats in the 70's. And the lace-up bodice tops? Man-oh-man - that whole gauz-y gypsy look with the bare feet? I was all over that - I must have sewed myself a million skirts and tops.

And those little off-the-shoulder tops? Remember those? Actually they're coming back in now. I loved those. I bought the prettiest off-the-shoulder 3/4 sleeve t-shirt this weekend to go with a skirt for spring.

Cass,
I think what Masked Menace was getting at is that he wasn't but uhm...a *little squirt* , and at that-- in the late 70's.

How about Nehru Shirts
Moccassins'
Bib Overalls
Fishnet hose (which I don't wear, but can't say I dislike)
White go-go boots
CPO Jackets ( plaid/wool with pockets [where I typically *hid* my menthols from my mom]
"Ski Jackets" , as they were called. Navy blue for me thank you, because I LOVED the color it turned into underneath the street lights--WHICH NOOOO...was not *my corner*...or where I spent alot of time, thank you very much!

I had probably EVERY color of T-shirt JC Penneys made. I forget what the "style" name was. They did have a single pocket and I ALWAYS bought them oversized and wore them with shorts. The summer I worked at City Hall (NO, not community service for hanging around on street corners. SHEESH!). I actually earned a paycheck---There was a cop there that had about 12 kids. In the same breath he was giving me some sort of fatherly advice about me and my middle bro being nice to my mom (we had earned an undeserved rep for being hellyons), he looked me up and down [in my long t-shirt and hidden shorts] and said: "You sure don't leave much to the imagination". WTH????

Even in school, the teachers never seemed to fuss at the short chicks with their mini skirts. Because of my height & long legs, it only LOOKED like my skirts were shorter, bammit! (~;)

Cass,
I was very much into cordurouy. I made my OWN cord bell bottoms that I basically lived in, and I made them SOOO long I walked on the hems..which was actually a "thing" to do anyway.

I got some of the wildest hand me downs from older cousins in PA, too. One of my favorites then, most horrifying NOW---bell bottom hip huggers (the bell started at the knee) that were this psychedelic swirl pattern colors like pink, orange, yellow, etc., that were just a notch up from pastels. A little like the aftermath of a salt water taffy fire.

I LOVED my metallic grey platforms, too. Heck, I may be able to dig em up somewhere. So WHAT if they made me about 6' 3"...hehehe.
Before I read Cass' comment about them I had noticed the cool shoes on the left of her pic and thought: "I LIKE those". BTW, Cass---I too just NEVER got into basic brown shoes. Either black or tannish..or white for me.

One my fave shoes was a pair of black patents that actually had a gold zipper on the top/ upper center that ran from the tip of the shoe to the opening. And what about "Spats". I only knew ONE girl that had those. I think they may have been a throw back THEN from like the 40's or 50's??

I did my entire bedroom in red, white & blue. I painted the frames of and the knobs white and then alternated every other drawer red and blue. My mom, an amazing seamstress, accomodated me by making matching *star studded* bedspread and curtains. My furniture that remains in that room....STILL red, white & blue, including the painted on american flag (with one BIGGEE star) on the desktop part of the vanity.

I still like some of the hippie-esque styles, which basically is now called Bohemian isn't it?.

I actually have a pair of fishnet stockings now Cat :) I couldn't resist. It's fun being a grownup and getting to buy whatever you want.

Yeah, I hear spd does too.

Dear Lord, I'm not touching that one with a ten-foot pole.

And here I was thinking of tight sweaters and fishnet stockings :©) and you had to go and ruin it.

Oh yeah..the pleasant peasant look. Ralph Lauren even echoed it in one of his dresses in Vogue.
I have a few blouses and skirts...and really sort of liked it, as it was comfortable and easy to move around in. The bare feet set it all off something lovely.

Caftans! Birkenstocks! The Bjorn Borg look of the sweatband and Danskin skirts. I have one of those.
I used to wear it with a crepe backed satin Russian peasant blouse and a fabric belt.

The Cossack shirts were popular too. Go to Folkwear Patterns...I have a Galway cloak and some other ethnic patterns too. Only this time I am thinking 'wearable art.'

Pile, if nothing else, see if you can get to the Quilt Market in Houston, especially since you paint.

Oh, I'll let spd tell you all about his red fishnets Menace. I'm know I'm getting all turned on just thinking about it.

I am wearing them right now under my Hickey-Freeman pinstriped suit. Woo woo.

Speaking of fishnet stockings...Tim Curry is starring in Monty Python's new musical "Spamalot!"

heh.

Once again, I agree with Pile On. The 80s were better than the 70s overall. Bad hair is something the two decades had in common. Fashion however, was awful in the 1970s. Truckers weren't just necessary parts of the economy, they were "cool." And, in the 1980's, we had an economy. Try having one of those with half your decade being lead by Carter.

Early 70s, the bell bottoms/flare pants sucked because they would get caught in the spokes of your bike. I would see kids wiping out all over the neighborhood! Plus, the collars were so wide you could hangglide on them. Nothing, though, was worse than the uber-wide ties which were like tying a blanket around your neck.

Late 70s, I remember my VELOUR shirt with a zipper down to my belly-button (I had the six-pack abs to flash back then), all the t-shirts with cheesy phrases on them, and lots of bad polyester stuff.

Now hot pants and halter tops for the ladies, Cass, ain't NOTHIN' wrong wit dat! Can I get an amen from the fellas out there?

:©)

Since someone already mentioned the platform shoes, my next dorkiest fashion accessory ... Mood ring.

Well I'll give the not-smartest fashion accessory once you have children: tube tops.

Hint: don't wear them down to the local Piggly-Wiggly when you have a very curious 8-month old who weighs 27 pounds and is nursing...

Good thing I am fast.

I was thinking about the mood rings, Frodo, when I was away from the puter. AND "Go Go rings". Not just go go boots, but rings.

"Bling" (faux, as it were) was also a pretty big 70's thing. I was REAL into the "medallions [necklaces] I had one with a little, porcelain like eyeball in the center. Like most everything else, jewelrywise [including the class ring *sniff*] I have NO idea where it went. Probably my neighbor stole it and with so many other things on the list that provoked us to break into his house and steal BACK, we never looked for the jewelry. (~;)

Cricket,
JimmyTheLeg [from TOB] went to see Spamalot this last weekend in NY. I'm curious. No report back yet though.

How about "Jean Jackets"? I have a MINT condition Levi's jacket, as well as PERFECT condition Levi's [36" inseam] flare leg and bell bottoms. I really should go to ebay.

One nice thing about the wide hems was us altitudinous ones had at least SOMETHING to work with to make em long enough. Short people whining about always having to hem UP their pants annoyed the hound outta me. I'd always have to enlighten them as to the beauty of them at least having something to work with. (~;) Unless they're Capri's, high water pants are a horror.

You're right, of course Cat, but at the same time it is REALLY irritating to have to cut 2-3" off a pair of jeans every time you buy them (like I usually do). But you're right - better than the alternative :)

Oh Oh Oh...and who could forget the "Maxi dress", including with the umpire waist (pretty much like the baby dolls with elastic)

And does anyone still wear "dickies"? Those horrid "fake turtle neck bibs". The edges or bottom would always managee to work their way out of your shirt or sweater anyway.

I still like the peasant blouse style. Sorry Cass, but I have a newish type one (from a consignment shop) that's purple. I just have to have open neck lines and detest anything up on my neck. Strangely, I share that same quirk with my mom. I will wear a cowl or turtle neck type sweather, as long as it's not wrapped around my neck...especially upper. arrrggghhh.

Cass, No doubt you want to NOT have to do alterations on your clothes all the time. It's nice to be able to just buy it and wear it.

It was probably us amazon-esque ones who started the trend of putting lace, trim, and adding fringe, etc to the hems of our pants--out of necessity. (~;)

Quiana - good gawd, there is a word out of the past. I had platform Black-n-White saddle shoes, and pastel plaid cuffed pants, with a yellow turtleneck body suit.
*shudder*
I'm going to have bad dreams just thinking about that!

Yes, I paint, but what exactly am I supposed to do with a quilt?

I had a pair of bib overalls. Always handy when you live in the suburbs of Long Island.

spd, I showed up to my wedding in bare feet, a scoop-necked tee, and a pair of denim overalls.

I kid you not. It was the seventies.

I laugh when I read the articles these days about girls having to have limos and having their makeup and hair professionally done. What the heck happened to just being yourself?

I cut my own hair and did my own makeup and my dress cost under $200 dollars and I got my flowers at Giant, and you know, it wasn't half bad. My bridesmaids' dresses didn't match, but one was 19 (same age as me) and one was 12 - I didn't think they should wear the same dress. I thought they should pick a dress that suited their age, so I gave them a color and let them pick their own darned dress so they'd be happy with it and they both looked lovely - prettier than I did, in fact.

In some ways the 70's was a silly decade. But in some ways I think that was a lot healthier attitude towards life.

I believe crammed somewhere into the hidden recesses of my dinky closet is a halter top, full length (maxi) white w/black and red, dress I bought in Holland for my Grandparents 50th bash. I also have a tapestry (10 lbs when wet) maxi, double breasted, royal blue lined coat, with a lambs fur trimmed hood, that I made in home Ec. WITH *fashion show* deadline looming!! What a project!! Imagine how thick the buttonhole reinforcements were using tapestry!?!?! Only machine I could use for some parts was a treddle. Electrics were a no-go.

I agree Cass--all the "angst" aside, some of the 70's simplicity is welcome back, IMO

70'S look in Raider Nation: Pocket-Tees and Blue Jeans.

00's look in Raider Nation: Pocket-Tees and Khakis.

There is such a thing as a classic look.

Good Lord, Cassie--when I did that high school fly-in, you were the kid who kept pulling my sleeve and asking if I was *sure* I wasn't a Marine...

[*swat*][*duck*][*clean miss*]

Bill... just 'cause I was a funny-looking kid is no reason to make fun of me :)

Cass - Naw--you were a *cute* kid. Badly in need of a pedicure, though...

[*whap*] YIPE!

I heard my name.
Yes I did go see Spamalot this weekend and it was wierd to see Tim Curry looking like the nornal male.
I will refrain from talking about 70's clothing since I have nothing to add. I was one of those sheeple had had to have everything that made you look cool to the hippies girls in the school.
And it scares me to think of CKC with platforms. I needed them just to be tall enough to look someone as tall as she is in the eye.

"And it scares me to think of CKC with platforms. I needed them just to be tall enough to look someone as tall as she is in the eye."===jimmytheleg

*big sigh* How MANY times do we have to remind you *those* AREN'T our EYES!!?!?!?

Perhaps a pair of steroid enhanced platforms would have had you at eye level, jtl!

Kitty! After telling me I ought to be smitten for racy comments, look what YOU just said (even if it is true, BTW).

*BIG sigh, again!*
AFE,

Apples:
"Makeout music: Whatever current love song got the girls going. The music was irrelevant to the focus of the mission, so to speak. How else did any guy listen to a Duran Duran song except when trying to get some action from a woman?"

Oranges:
"*big sigh* How MANY times do we have to remind you *those* AREN'T our EYES!!?!?!?
Perhaps a pair of steroid enhanced platforms would have had you at eye level, jtl!

Unless it's a (still) bothersome conscious that's speaking, I do NOT see how you can even compare the two!

You admitted to participating in smite worthy behavior of your trying to score with women by virtue of hypnotizing (manipulating?) them. [Weird point to make using "virtue"!! (~;]

Whereas OTOH, I was trying to help a member of the male species avoid smite worthy behavior by offering a simple [but OFT repeated] anatomical lesson. If I saw that my comment was as R rated as yours, I'd admit to it. What I WILL admit to is that mine was a double barrel comment, in that I also seized the opportunity to lob a snark bomb at a member of the VC species [VC=vertically challenged].

You were condoning smite worthy behavior.
I was discouraging it---via anatomical lesson/eye exam.

As the soda bottle caps say: "you are not a winner, try again" (~;) [but you know I still love ya, right?]

The feeling of admiration is mutual, Dear Kitty.

While your hairsplitting is of the first order, you must recall that I freely mentioned I was a wayward lad, who was easily led astray by villainous company, as well as my own rogueish nature. This was pre-christian times for me as well. I was laughing at the young man I was then, and my former attitudes, not condoning them.

You OTOH, specifically referred to the female anatomy and, as is well known, men are amazed and awestruck when viewing or contemplating same. Its like offering a drink to an alcoholic! For example, Daisy Duke in a halter top was known to strike men dumb and speechless for days. You can't invoke such mindbending weapon(s) and then act like you said nothing at all.

You know very well you were preying upon the inherent genetic weakness of men when it comes to a fine-looking woman!

"You OTOH, specifically referred to the female anatomy..."

AFE,
BOY I hope I can get through this coherently.[it's very very late] The ONLY "female anatomy" I SPECIFIED were the EYES!!

I make painstaking efforts not to tease, taunt or prey on the imaginations of men. Just the other day after I read Cass' post about a tube top experience of hers, I e-mailed her about a FAR more benign one of my own INTENTIONALLY because I didn't want to come off as some exhibitionist by posting ANYTHING about it, and it was hardly risque, or something that I thought would "tease" the imagination. I simply chose to steer as FAR right of the [possible] cliff on the left as possible.

I can't manage your imagination, AFE. Quite frankly I am quite...perhaps OVERLY [aka: prudishly] considerate when posting anything that could be misconstrued as "preying upon the genetic weakness of your gender". I just don't GO there. PERIOD!

My comments were #1, using an "obvious" about males to smart off to JTL while seizing the oppty to jab him about his height! (which he's used to in our TWO way "vertically related" snark attacks)

"You know very well you were preying upon the inherent genetic weakness of men when it comes to a fine-looking woman!"===AFE

Do you realize how close your *accusation* borders to calling me dishonest and a liar?? IMB, that run's a close 2nd to being spit on!

And WHO's a "fine looking woman"??.....according to WHO"?....based on WHAT?......You have no guarantees that I don't double for her! Perhaps the males of the more impressionable, vulnerable, weakened persuasion would do good to have that kind of an image readily available at all times for your minds eye, for the purpose of fending off "pending danger".

Did I link a picture of Daisy Duke in a halter top, claiming it was me??? Did I MENTION Daisy Duke or Britney or...or.... [puhhhhh-freakin'-LEEZ!] Did I hint at a bra size?...ANYTHING?.. Did I paint ANY sort of visual...OTHER than a height disparity??? I never mentioned ANYTHING about ANY "fine looking woman", nor claim to be one. Sure, I eluded to "boobage" and specified eyes, but again, it appears your vivid imagination is causing you more trouble than anything I said, AFE. And at the risk of saying something inappropriately "public", I believe there's some place for empathy toward you given your recent *situation*.

You pretty much took a canvas, with a couple of VERY sketchy *details* to go on, grabbed your own palate and painted your own picture from your own imagination.

Heck, in some ways, you've *forced* me to use far more specific terminology than I would ever prefer to , simply in attempting to clarify my position (aka: rightly defend myself!)

Were you to meet me and know more about me, you'd probably be quite disappointed and disillusioned. I'm not saying that as some sort of clever putdown of myself. In doing radio, I've had more than my share of trepidation about what people expect and what they get when I'd do public gigs. Imagine the disappointment of the majority of people expecting a short, petite blonde. HA! I could always breathe a sigh of relief when they expected a tall, non-petite brunette. OF course my favorite experience was the lil ol' southerner that drawled out: "well, you's alot purtier than I expected you to be. I thought you might be kinda frumpy"....Whatever the helk THAT was suppose to mean. (~;)

I'm not angry with you. And I'd be arrogant & presumptuous to not admit to wrong doing if I saw that I was "guilty as charged". I also would not have integrity of heart if I were to admit to guilt for something I simply see no reason to "own"! I've lived that way once just to "keep the peace", and avoid the uncharted waters of honest and productive confrontation. [I grew up believing that "combat" and "confrontation" were synonomous]. I later learned that taking the (unmerited) blame
was also dishonest "appeasing".

Honest to GOD, if I felt...believed I said anything inappropriate, I'd fess up to it.

Oh, and one more thing: When I made the comment about "smiting", I was merely playing up on a comment you made about "smiting" on another thread and it was nothing more than a playful, claw retracted swat. As you were recalling your misguided BC youth, laughing---I was laughing when dogging you about it! There wasn't an ounce of judgment or phariseeism intended by it. I can't speak for how it was perceived though.

Sorry Cass for eating so much bandwidth in my sleep deprived AND determined state.

Sorry, AFE. With God Himself as my witness, I can't give you this one. Not until such a time as a case of deception on my part is *divinely* spotlighted.

I have to say, I kinda understand the whole Burkha thing a little better, now. (~;)

I have to second Cat on this one. Ironically that's something I was musing about to her the other day via email.

Part of the dichotomy between men and women, afe, as I'm sure you realize, is that our minds work differently on a very basic level. One such difference is that the vast majority of women can prattle on about sex (or anatomy) with each other without it leading to any other thoughts - we do it all the time. To us, it's a topic like any other - part of life - we don't really think much about it.

And I forget that difference all the time, even though I know better, because I feel comfortable around you guys, and at my age no one is likely to be having fantasies about me (unless they're horrible nightmares like visions of Helen Thomas). I have a sardonic sense of humor that often doesn't come across in print (why would it?) that sometimes leads me down the wrong path.

I guess what I'm saying is, it's hard to know how what you say will be processed and translated, and Cat is smarter than I am.

Kitty: My comments to you were very much non-serious and definitely tongue-in-cheek! I was just teasing and (mostly) poking fun at how men react to the female anatomy, rather than anything else.

I know you better than that! You know I am quite fond of you, and enjoy your posts, so I will assume that you on the outside is as nice as you on the inside. Actually, though, I was using "you" in the general sense re the male reaction to women.

What led me to this observation was an experience I had last week. I was standing around with several male friends when an attractive woman walked by. Even though we had been having a deep and heated political discussion, all conversation ceased automatically as she walked by, and no one could remember where we had left off on the conversation. Our brains had been wiped clean by visions of female loveliness. I thought this was hilarious! I then mentioned something like this in my post to you as a comment on male-female differences and male behavior patterns.

Thus, while I know your post only referred to men's well-known tendency to stare at women's breasts, most guys reading that probably focused on the idea of "breasts" to the exclusion of everything else. It may be sad, but its oh so true.

Cass: Your insight on men is very true. Guys may not be willing to admit this, particularly in front of women where they're likely to be lambasted for thinking/acting that way, but get a bunch of guys together talking freely and its a whole nuther story.

Men are more primal, and "hardwired" to respond to women physically. That does not mean we ACT on those impulses, but those impulses are still there. Women know this full well, as women's fashions, make-up, etc. will attest.

HELLO...(*echo* hellooo...hellooo...hellooooooooo)
This place is starting to look like a ghost town! I hope I don't AGAIN *waste* my time here.

AFE, you GOOB! You had me jumping through hoops at 3 a.m. for NOTHING? As annoying as they are, use smiley faces!!!. We have no voice inflexion or facial expressions to work with, SOOOOO They're about the only saving grace when left with mere words on a *page*

Well, actually---whether you were joking or not-- some comments in your most recent posts here are proof positive that the whole "Adam & Eve" thang is still alive and well. Especially where you yourself have, to varying degrees, basically "paraphrased" Adam: "It's that woman, God!!. SHE gave me the apple and I was obligated to partake." HA! Nothing new under the sun, is there? (~;)

And just so you know (and I think you already do). A fine man walking by is also capable of "interrupting" a conversation amongst a group of females. The difference being that after we momentarily made our giggling-laced comments and were able to once again put syllables together, we'll be right back on track of the "pre-interrupted" topic.

AFE said: "Our brains had been wiped clean by visions of female loveliness."

Do I need to explain why I find that highlighted "yeah, right" an amusing choice of word? (~;

I think this broad brush concept has defaulted into a much smaller one, since a more brazen, aggressive femme has evolved over time, but, one explanation for the femme & men difference is that women can see a nice car and just appreciate & admire it's "look", whereas men usually want to take it for a test drive.

And I still don't know what message my parents were trying to send when they named my other lovely sisters, Faith, Hope, Charity...and then me "Pestilence"....? What's up with that? (~;)

afe,

re: Women know this full well, as women's fashions, make-up, etc. will attest.

I sometimes get the impression (although this may not have been what you were suggesting) that men think women are manipulating them. That, I think, is a street that goes both ways.

I can't tell you how depressing we find it, this male pre-occupation with appearance. I have, on more than one occasion, thrown up my hands in puzzlement. The aging woman in particular is aware of this as an issue, and I say this as someone who doesn't really lack too much confidence with men, but has seen too many good women hurt by guys who judge by outward appearances, never bothering to see what is on the inside.

And though, as you say, all conversation may come to a halt when a beautiful woman goes by, most of us don't look like that, and never will. Nor do we look like the girls in the magazines, unless we have some sort of surgery. So although we try to look nice, inside each of us is mentally comparing ourselves to some 19 year-old with surgically-enhanced breasts and airbrushed thighs. And believe me, we can never quite measure up - in our own eyes, or yours.

Girls are trained (and also hard-wired by nature) to want to please. Watch a baby girl and she does it from infancy - no one has to teach her how. We do it, most of the time, almost unconsciously: we offer that which we think will amuse, or please, or even sometimes titillate the male of the species. And we do it, most of the time, not out of a desire to control or manipulate, but because we like to create beauty or arouse pleasure in those we care about. It's instinctive.

But, that said, you can't imagine how often we wish we'd be appreciated for our other qualities. And, because until I was on the Internet recently, I'd never been around men who talked about women's bodies openly, I sometimes wonder if some men (not you, because I've never heard you do this) ever stop to think just how churlish they sound?

How women feel, listening to them?

I can look at a nice-looking man and admire him (although honestly I'm just not all that interested - what good does it do me?), but I suppose it would never occur to me to go on and on about it (beside the obvious comment that he looks nice - duh...) because obviously not all men look like that. And that's fine with me - I don't want some stupid supermodel for a mate: I want someone intelligent and real, and warm and immediate. Not a set of abs or biceps.

And, strangely, I'm married to a guy who's in pretty darned good shape - he actually looks better than the day I married him. But I wouldn't ever want him to read some comment I made about another man and feel bad. I guess this is just another thing I don't understand about men - vive la difference, or whatever they say.

Kitty: Your are too funny and witty, as always! I see how you do your little wink thing, but how do you do a smiley face? And you're right, ever since Pile On did his salute to Daisy Duke on his site a little while back, an image of her pops up whenever I think of female loveliness, so it was MY interjection of her, not yours. But you have to admit, she sure was fine! Mmmmmm. I need a moment of private time to reflect.

Actually, though, my alternate thought was to have the whole conversation done as my Mullah alter-ego. That was probably the better course, and would have been more clear, rather than trying to joke around straightfaced.

Mansquito (love the nom de plume, BTW): Girls nowadays are just as raunchy/forward talking about guys, believe me! I think this is a generational, more than a gender difference. With today's post-feminist girls, yesterdays gender roles and views have been tossed out the window. Women have become just as coarse as men.

I believe men really are "hardwired" by nature to respond to the physical. A shallow, adolescent skirt-chaser like Bill Clinton never moves beyond those primal urges. A real, mature man will look at physical attractiveness as only one factor in a complete package.

A woman who is physically stunning, but has no other attributes can, ummm, "please" a man for a while, but he will eventually grow bored with her lack of brains, personality, etc, unless he is in a state of permanent adolescence like Clinton.

Personally, I go for the well-rounded package (pun only partially intended). The beautiful bimbos , after adolescence when my hormones settled down, I found to be excruciatingly painful. This is because I found that the size of the brain seems to vary inversely with the size and volume of the mouth. In other words, the bimbos would be nonstop chatterboxes with absolutely nothing to say! It made me want to stab a screwdriver in my ear to, please God, MAKE IT STOP!

The woman to whom I was most attracted in my life was one of the more plain girls, physically-speaking, that I have known. She more than made up for this with charm, wit, personality, and purity of soul. She was one of those people that lit up a room from sheer force of personality, and was so genuinely nice, that you felt good just talking to her for 5 minutes.

Had I met her ten years later, I probably would have proposed. Sadly, I was far too young and foolish at the time for us to have been anything other than (slightly flirty) friends.

So while its humorous to poke fun at general gender stereotypes, they are, after all, only stereotypes.

MANsquito,
Were you married in San Fransisco? Just wondering. You talk of your husband, and actually sounded alot like the Blog Princess. It threw me off when I got to your name though.

AFE,
Your right, it would be a good idea for you to "go entirely into character" and sign as such.

And another thing: in truth, I think I'm really more of a Brat Cat than a witty *kitty*. (~;)

Pssst! those pesky *smileys* are simply parenthesis ["shift" 9 or "shift" 0]..which ever direction you choose to face, I face west on this page, north geographically...meaning that anyone looking from down the road at Fort Carson or even all the way down in Mexico would think I was standing on my head! hehe.

Oh, I remember what I was going to say. It was already in the 80's when I had the eyes wide open awakening on how many femmes had evolved into brazen, brash, forward, raunch chicks. There was a guy from my church, who was in or JUST out of high school. He worked part time with me. I asked him if he was headed over to the preferred Tulsa club (for those kids)--he wasn't a nerdy, overly sheltered kid either, but his response was my wake up call: He said: "Are you kidding?? Those chicks there are only after ONE thing." HUH? I was stunned. I remember a time that was what we femmes said about guys!!

IMHO, despite aggressive chickdom, I don't think the basic nature of a man as pursuer, "conqueror", et al., has changed....unless they're pretty wimped out already, and then it seems the woman grows to resent that eventually because he's expected to "take charge". Is that perhaps, in part, evidenced by womens attraction to men in uniform?? meeeOWWZA.

Oi Vey...I said so little in so much bandwidth. Step AWAY from the screwdiver, AFE. (Ouch my ear hurts from that word picture.)

arrrggg.."You're right"...NOT "Your right"....grrrr...and besides, women don't particularly like to have to repeat those words when addressing a guy, for the good of his own ego, of course. When a man gloats at the sound of a female voice saying "You're right" he gloats perilously so. *insert smiley face*

I bask luxuriously in the warmth of my acknowledged rectitude. :)

Uhm AFE,
You might want to set a timer. Just so you don't catch too many of those harmful UV Right rays. After all, I acknowledged your rightness in your eluding to your wrongness in not following through with your "alternate thought" by going into full on Mullah character. IOW-- I basically said you were right to admit you were wrong. heh!

Besides, you also gave ME a "You're right". It's only that your "you're" was spelled right the first time, alright. Sooooo...don't be overdoin' that basking just yet. I just don't see a need to admit to basking in the first place. Am I right? heh!

So what'll it be?..Phillips or flat head Q-tip? (~;)

(still basking): Awww, don't be that way, Kitty! Come on in to my basking pool. The water is nice and warm, and tropical breezes gently caress your cares away. There's plenty of rectitude to go around, and I don't mind sharing.

"Come on in to my basking pool. The water is nice and warm...==said AFE, foolishly.

hehehe...Cats + Water?? HA! = ANYTHING but "cares being gently caressed away". Try flesh being scratched away. (~;)

Besides, Cats are ALWAYS right and never feel a need to announce it. We are perpetual "baskers" [not to be confused with "basket cases"]

[Hmm...In that case, perhaps I'm only HALF cat, since humanly speaking---I'm more of a fish. (~;). OH NOOOOO! I'M A DICHOTOMY!!!...err...dichatamy--?]